WTF Just Happened: How a Skeptic Found Proof of the Afterlife

After her father died, Liz Entin assumed the afterlife was fantasy - as realistic as the tooth fairy. Then she found university research that changed everything.

Liz Entin is a logical skeptic who set out to disprove the afterlife and ended up proving it exists. She's conducted 80+ medium readings (with hidden identity and fake names), studied children with verifiable past life memories, and discovered research so compelling that even Carl Sagan said it was "worthy of serious investigation."

She's also the woman who testified in the Harvey Weinstein trial - and whose Chihuahua famously chased him around her apartment.

[00:00] Introduction & Hosts Preview
[01:19] Meet Liz Entin
[01:26] How WTF Just Happened Started
[03:00] Driven by Grief and Hope
[03:50] What Blew Her Away About the Research
[04:51] Children with Past Life Memories
[05:56] Thousands of Cases Documented
[06:40] How Does She Explain It?
[07:55] The Logical Atheist's Perspective
[08:55] Preponderance of Evidence
[09:41] Will You See Your Dad Again?
[10:57] 80+ Medium Readings
[12:31] How to Know If Mediums Are Real
[14:32] Talking to Dead People vs Nefarious Spirits
[16:24] Random Number Generators Study
[18:13] Global Consciousness Project
[19:43] Consciousness Affecting Physical Reality
[21:40] Three Takeaways from Her Research
[23:01] Harvey Weinstein Trial Testimony
[24:18] Why She Testified
[27:30] Her Famous Chihuahua Peanut
[28:13] Will We See Our Pets Again?
[29:14] Could She Ever Believe in God?
[31:07] How to Reach Liz

The evidence that convinced her:
- Children with Past Life Memories:
- University of Virginia researchers Dr. Jim Tucker and Dr. Ian Stevenson have documented thousands of cases
- Kids under 5 remember specific details: names, locations, how they died
- James Leininger: Remembered dying in WWII plane crash, knew aircraft details only experts would know, identified three men from his squadron by hair color
- Civil War case: Child knew soldier's name, wife's name, specific battle where he died
- Carl Sagan endorsed this research as valid and worthy of serious study

Her conclusion: "There's a preponderance of evidence - probably beyond a reasonable doubt at this point."

Liz testified in the Harvey Weinstein trial. Her 12-pound Chihuahua, Peanut, chased Harvey around her apartment and he was terrified. The story went viral worldwide. She says without doubt he is guilty.

On grief and hope:
"I'm much more scared of permanent obliteration than any other form of consciousness. Finding this evidence brought joy combined with the worst I've ever felt."

Resources:
Website: WTFJustHappened.net
Podcast: WTF Just Happened
Instagram: @WTFJustHappened (most active)
Books: Available on website
Science & Spirituality Salons: Intimate events with verified mediums
Documentary: Netflix's "Surviving Death" features this research

Transcript

00:02 - Stacey (Host)
Hey Stace, yeah, omar, how you doing. 

00:04 - Mark (Host)
I am excited to talk to Liz Enten today. 

00:06 - Stacey (Host)
Me too. 

00:08 - Mark (Host)
She bills herself as a logical atheist. She says there's no proof of God. We can get into that, that's fine. But she spends a lot of time and research and has proven to herself now that there is an afterlife. Yeah, that's fascinating. 

00:22 - Stacey (Host)
It came from a very personal place because her father passed away and she really hit her hard and she wanted to find answers to see if maybe perhaps she could speak to him again. She also has a podcast called WTF that talks about all the things that she found. She's found out. She will have a lot of evidence to back up the fact that she believes that there's an afterlife and that you can see your loved ones. 

00:43 - Mark (Host)
Yeah, we're get into the studies. We're going to get into the university research we're going to get into all of that, because anybody could say, oh yeah, there's an afterlife, she has, she. 

00:52 - Stacey (Host)
She's bringing receipts from what I understand and cool side thing is that she actually testified in the harvey weinstein trial. We were definitely going to talk to her about that, you don't? 

01:03 - Mark (Host)
often get a witness right. We'll definitely cover that as well. This is going to be a crazy conversation, but I think as sort of heady as it is she has the ability to, I think, ground it in reality and ground it in science. Hi, I'm Stacey and I am Mark, and this is the Gurus of Game Changers podcast. Happy to have you in the studio. Welcome, Liz. Thanks for coming on the show. 

01:29 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Oh my God, thank you, I'm happy to be here. 

01:32 - Stacey (Host)
Can you, in your own words, explain how WTF happened? 

01:36 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Yes, well, sadly, in 2015, my dad passed away. At that point I assumed an afterlife was fantasy, like about as realistic as the tooth fairy. And then I had, like, my very first thought. You know, you're kind of in that groggy, unclear grief state and the first thing that came to my mind was is time travel possible? And I started to think, well, we could be time traveling now and have no idea, depending how our consciousness interacts with time. 

02:07
So I began to read a lot of books about Einstein's theories of time relativity. Time travel's theoretically possible. It's just a little bit hard. We have to be able to find a way to build spaceships that travel at certain speeds. I mean, that's a whole other topic. But theoretically, yes, time travel's possible. Then I began to think what else is possible, because then I had a thought I was like is there some way, by some mechanism that I can't begin to understand, that any memories carried over, if this was true? And I Googled that and that's where I found doctors Jim Tucker and Ian Stevenson, child psychiatrists, and they're studying cases of kids with past life memories in a very data-based way. And it was adding up. I read books, I read studies. It was about a month of huddled in bed, unable to get out of bed, reading everything I could find on those two, and that was the start of an absolute worldview changing experience Were you completely driven by the fact that my dad died in 2010? 

03:10 - Stacey (Host)
And I know. I had like at least a year of like. What am I doing here? Were you driven by? Maybe someday seeing your dad again somehow? 

03:19 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Yeah, it was a combination. It was definitely grief and just I just you can't. When you lose someone that's been part of of your life, your whole life, and someone you love and someone you're close with, they're just, it's incomprehensible. I mean just the joy to be like, oh my God, there's a chance that this isn't it. It was just, I couldn't think of anything. It was like imagine you woke up tomorrow and had like a trillion dollars in your bank account. 

03:52 - Mark (Host)
This was better you know, and it brought this joy combined with just the worst I've ever felt. So what was it? Your words were you when you investigated this after your father passed? Your words were that you were blown away what was it that blew you away? 

04:00 - Liz Entin (Guest)
well, first of all, that these researchers were normal. That was, I mean, this was the first part I kept. I mean, I still get blown away to this day because I keep learning more and more meaning normal by smart people or smart people. They weren't talking like woo woo, yeah, they weren't like, oh, like your actions affect your next life. 

04:19
They weren't all you know fluffy, it was just data. They're like this is what's happening these kids are reporting these memories and then we match it up to a family and it matches. And they weren't jumping to multiple. 

04:34 - Stacey (Host)
That's crazy. Wait a minute, I gotta just back up a little bit. I know you probably have another follow-up to that, but so these children weren't just telling stories, like because I can imagine, like you're hearing a kid. Yeah, yeah, in my past life I met Skippy, my you know my dog. Yes, so these researchers realized that these kids were telling stories and those stories actually matched to other families and they would find this with multiple families. 

05:01 - Liz Entin (Guest)
I will do a very, very abbreviated version of one of the most famous ones. This was apparently the one that absolutely convinced Dr Jim Tucker. This was real. It's James Leininger. He was having nightmares every night which apparently can be typical of children with past life memories. So he's under five years old, woke up every night screaming like crying little playing on fire, little man go down. Playing on fire, fire, little man go down. Plane on fire, little man go down. 

05:27
So this went completely out of anything this little boy would have ever heard. You know one point he was taken at, I think, three years old at this point, to a I don't remember if it's like an airplane exhibit or a world war ii specific airplane exhibit, but he knew stuff like he knew these details that only an expert would know. I think he might have even said they got something wrong and it was researched. They trace him to a person who died. He ends up meeting this person's sister, who's now in her 90s. He ends up meeting the people who'd been in his Air Force with him, who were still living. The hair colors of the dolls matched up to three men who were in his air force with those names how old was this kid? 

06:06
he was under five. They all have to be under five for the case to be valid and how many of these kids were there. 

06:12 - Stacey (Host)
Yeah, was that what you're? 

06:14 - Mark (Host)
gonna ask no no. Oh, how many cases there's yeah, thousands yes I heard one where a child outlined he was probably five and he outlined that he died in the Civil War and he knew his name and he knew his wife's name and they researched it. They found the guy. They saw the battle where the guy died. 

06:31 - Stacey (Host)
They knew his wife's name First and last names. 

06:32 - Mark (Host)
I don't know if they had his last name, but he definitely had his first name. He had his wife's first name and they traced it back to a specific guy who died in a specific battle. So then you say like and I'm a skeptic, we all know that, but that's interesting. Like, how do you explain that? And I can't. 

06:48 - Liz Entin (Guest)
But you explain it. 

06:49 - Mark (Host)
How do you explain it? 

06:50 - Liz Entin (Guest)
I don't know, but I will answer that. But I do want to add, since you said you're a skeptic, Carl Sagan commented on the work of Dr Ian Stevenson and he said he doesn't think the answer is reincarnation. But he said he doesn't think the answer is reincarnation. But he said his research is valid and worthy of serious investigation. He just thinks they haven't come up with the conclusion, Like what? 

07:11 - Stacey (Host)
is it, if it's not reincarnation? 

07:12 - Liz Entin (Guest)
I think it is. 

07:13 - Stacey (Host)
Yeah, ok, but Carl Sagan wouldn't say it was Carl Sagan, but he didn't delve in. Yeah. 

07:18 - Liz Entin (Guest)
I mean, I think, how do I explain it? I think our consciousness is not created by a brain, I think it's downloaded by a brain in some form we don't understand, and you know it downloads into one person. Then that essentially uploads when the body passes. 

07:37 - Stacey (Host)
And then part of it downloads and uploads the cloud when Where's the cloud? 

07:41 - Mark (Host)
Where's it going? The brain cloud? The reincarnation cloud? Who's at the keyboard? 

07:46 - Stacey (Host)
I believe there's something up there, but I also believe in afterlife. And you're like how is that possible? And I think he has the same question for you how is that possible? Because you'd have to. 

07:55 - Mark (Host)
you believe I'm putting words in your mouth but you believe that you'd have to believe in god, why? 

08:05 - Liz Entin (Guest)
I don't understand why either yeah why tell? 

08:08 - Stacey (Host)
us where? 

08:09 - Mark (Host)
where are all of the consciousness, the collective of consciousness? Where is it going and what is the point if there is no god? 

08:20 - Liz Entin (Guest)
but there could be what. I mean that I have multiple answers for that. First of all, there could be no point. This is just how it could work. There could always be no point. Yeah, we have no idea where it goes. Some other dimension, like our 3D material. Brains can't process it, any more than we can process the concept of 360-degree vision which near-death experiencers seem to have. We can't process a tesseract. The fifth dimension yeah. 

08:45 - Mark (Host)
But there seems to be other dimensions so I definitely want to talk to you about dimensions in a second right before yeah, we go there you have no physical proof of an afterlife and yet you have a knowing that it exists no, are you all right? 

08:59 - Liz Entin (Guest)
that's like it's like being religious you don't have a belief that it exists I think there's a preponderance of evidence that it's the most logical conclusion. 

09:05 - Mark (Host)
Okay, you're leaning heavily into the reasoning and logic, which I appreciate. You should be a lawyer. That was great. 

09:10 - Stacey (Host)
That was really good. I am considering that Preponderance of evidence yeah, but. 

09:15 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Or even the sap, beyond a reasonable doubt, probably at this point Got it. 

09:23 - Stacey (Host)
It could be God, it could be the universe, it could be the energy, it could be the cells in the air. It could be you know. 

09:30 - Liz Entin (Guest)
It could be a collective consciousness. Yes, I mean, I can't say for a fact, no, there's no God. I just have no reason to. I've seen no evidence. Sure, it's a huge jump to assume. 

09:41 - Mark (Host)
It's a leap of faith, huge leap of faith Right. 

09:43 - Stacey (Host)
A leap of faith in both scenarios. 

09:45 - Mark (Host)
For sure. 

09:46 - Stacey (Host)
Wow. Do you believe you're going to meet your dad again one day? I think probably. 

09:51 - Liz Entin (Guest)
I think it's most likely. 

09:52 - Stacey (Host)
In what form? 

09:54 - Liz Entin (Guest)
If I could guess we're, you know, a form of non-physical and we probably have like a type of reflection still in our bodies. I can only base that part. I would love. 

10:05 - Stacey (Host)
that Was that great, I'm asking selfishly, because I would love to be able to see my dad again someday. Oh my God. 

10:10 - Mark (Host)
Yeah. 

10:10 - Stacey (Host)
Where Anywhere. 

10:12 - Mark (Host)
No, in any sense. 

10:14 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Not like Starbucks, I love it. 

10:15 - Stacey (Host)
I love it when he comes to my dreams. Right, and you know like it's just kind of Maybe that's real. Which? Is what Bob Ginsberg talked about too, so this gives me joy too. 

10:25 - Mark (Host)
Yeah, you're hopeful. 

10:26 - Stacey (Host)
It's kind of a colorful world for me too, but it's a skeptic. 

10:29 - Mark (Host)
I think that's the point of this is be hopeful Right, but for you, even if you grieve, there's hope that you'll see. But I think we're saying the same thing. So you think when you go to heaven you're going to run into people, people, but that's not reincarnation. I don't know that I believe in reincarnation, but again, you have plenty. 

10:51
There are plenty of examples of kids spouting off past life facts that I can't account for for sure, but is that is hope, the number one thing that you benefit? Is that the number one way this benefits you? It just makes you more hopeful when you wake up in the morning. 

11:07 - Liz Entin (Guest)
I think, hope, curiosity, fascination. I mean I like to explore the truth, I like to think about things. It seems to be the truth, I mean it's definitely drawing a conclusion, but based on a vast body of evidence, both data and anecdotal as well. A vast body of evidence, both data and anecdotal as well, but it's it's both really joyfully fun hope fascinating, all of it. 

11:33 - Stacey (Host)
So you're a skeptic, but you have. You said you've met with how many mediums. 

11:37 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Oh my god bob will never let me live this down. 

11:39 - Stacey (Host)
Yeah, bob ginsberg, like at this point, probably like almost like 80 or something. 

11:41 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Okay to tease me about this too. Like at this point, probably like almost like 80 or something, okay. 

11:46 - Stacey (Host)
So tell me about that 80 different readings, 80 different readings, if I count, like some group readings or I've been volunteering in Forever. 

11:52 - Mark (Host)
Family, you know. 

11:54 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Yeah, yeah, or like sometimes, I'll help. You know, if I take a class, I'll help be a sitter for training mediums. 

12:05 - Stacey (Host)
Right training mediums. 

12:06 - Liz Entin (Guest)
So if I bring that all together, I'd say about it because you volunteered with Bob Ginsberg's um organization, right right, but where I do the um readings, like, for example, I'll take a class on mediumship because I'm interested, and then you know I'm not a medium, but then someone will, they'll know I'm involved. But like, oh my, you know, are you able to be a like, sit with this medium who's training and then see how it goes for them? 

12:26 - Stacey (Host)
And how do you know then? Well, that's the same thing we asked Bob Ginsberg. So how would you know if the medium is really reading truthfully or not? Like Mark thinks that they're pretty much all Charlton's. I don't believe that, but how do you know? 

12:41 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Okay. So if I'm to go get a reading with a professional medium I'm not talking about if I sit with someone who's training- you know, a lot of times they can not be that good yet, but I can tell they're genuine hearted and they're trying. 

12:52
But in terms of one, that's good. Like I find one online, I go. Or you know, I just completely hide your identity. Fake name. Have a friend pay just completely hide your identity Fake name. Have a friend pay. 

13:05
I use a VPN on my computer so they can't trace me to book everything. If it's you know, if you have to give a phone number, if it's on the phone, I give a Google Voice number. If it's Zoom, I make a fake account under a different name. If it's in person, you know again, all fake information. But then they'll see my face. But you know, I started this research in 2016, where I got my first medium reading. That was before you know facial recognition technology, so that wasn't even something to take into account. That's probably something to take into account now. So you know you got to think about how to deal with that at this point. But so I go with all that. I say yes, say yes, no. Maybe that could make sense. Give a little more information. I say nothing but that. And they know specific things. They're getting names, they're getting specific memories. 

13:59 - Mark (Host)
I mean from where though? 

14:02 - Stacey (Host)
from the cloud no from from where the collective dead people from dead people yes, from dead Mediums talk to the dead From dead people. 

14:11 - Liz Entin (Guest)
But if there's a collective consciousness, that means information is stored non-physically in some cloud. So why could consciousness not be part of that, right? 

14:20 - Stacey (Host)
It could be. It could be. Why can't your grandmother or whoever come to this person and talk to them and tell them what to say to could be this other person? 

14:29 - Mark (Host)
right. There's also an increasing school of thought that says that mediums aren't talking to, if they're talking to the dead person, that they're not actually talking to dead person or speaking to a nefarious spirit what? 

14:42 - Stacey (Host)
who's pretending to? 

14:43 - Mark (Host)
be oh why what are your thoughts on that? 

14:46 - Liz Entin (Guest)
I mean, yeah, why it's out there? 

14:48 - Mark (Host)
people are saying like never go to a medium. They're not, they're talking to the darker side. 

14:51 - Liz Entin (Guest)
They're just pretending that they're. 

14:53 - Mark (Host)
This is out there and it's been talked about a lot, especially recently I mean that sounds like god devil. 

14:59 - Liz Entin (Guest)
I mean, there's no evidence, so there's no god or devil. There is no heaven or hell. 

15:03 - Mark (Host)
I don't think so there is just a consciousness that sometimes those conscious thoughts or I guess their consciousness it can download into a kid. Not necessarily an entire life, a thought or memory can download into a new life. So that kid now knows he also has a memory of dying in the Civil War. 

15:22 - Stacey (Host)
Was in World War II and his plane went down, and his wife's name is Rose. 

15:25 - Mark (Host)
Right. 

15:26 - Liz Entin (Guest)
so it's not reincarnation, it is borrowing consciousness from prior lives so dr tucker addresses that, because I I mean that's a really logical, it's possible, but it doesn't seem to be the most likely conclusion. First of all, these kids show no other psychic abilities in any other area. Um, they have so much emotion attached and normally when psychics are getting information and there's a difference between psychic information and mediumship information, which I can address too but normally when someone's getting psychic information or mediumship, it doesn't feel so personal, it feels so emotional to the kids and they have emotions Like they say they miss their other mom or their other dad and they'll cry and it's which is so different than a psychic I would love to see. 

16:16 - Stacey (Host)
Is there a documentary on this? I would love to watch that um netflix surviving death. 

16:21 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Yeah, yeah, it touches on that, okay, okay yeah robert was in that one surviving 

16:25 - Stacey (Host)
death yeah ginsburg, who was another episode that we have you need to check out. Yes, that was a great episode. 

16:30 - Mark (Host)
Yeah, god, that you need to check out. 

16:31 - Stacey (Host)
Yes, that was a great episode. 

16:31 - Mark (Host)
Go ahead. That was a great conversation. Wait, can I just jump? 

16:34 - Stacey (Host)
in with random number generators. This episode is brought to you by Mainline Studios and the Podcast Factory, where great content feels right at home. Located in beautiful Wayne, Pennsylvania, our creative rental space offers high-end tech in a space that feels like your best friend's living room. Book your session or a free tour at mainlinevideostudiocom and back to the show sure, so I heard a talk of the most fascinating study on this. 

17:04 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Well, there's theories that, like our thoughts, are inhibiting all of our psychic abilities. So one researcher, dr Morris Friedman, I heard him speak at a conference. He had a random not a number generator, but the same concept where a little circle was would either move left or right, and it was set up randomly and he tried to have people influence it. 

17:26 - Stacey (Host)
And when they try to influence it, are they sitting there and staring at it or thinking in their brain like I'm going to influence it? And when they try to influence it, are they sitting there and staring at it or thinking in their brain like I'm going to influence it. So it's all zeros, like something like that. 

17:33 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Probably, I mean I would assume, each person does it differently Maybe some visualization maybe some verbally, but I would probably try to do a combination of visualization and verbal if I was doing it. I mean, I don't have abilities, so it wouldn't do very much but you know, no, no effect. 

17:49
That was the control group he did one group where he did some, you know, electronic wave to a part of the brain that stopped the right side of the brain and then one that stopped the left side of the brain and I believe when the left side was stopped through these waves the people showed. The same people who can't do it showed significant results. Oh, which is insane. It's one of my favorite. 

18:17 - Stacey (Host)
Doesn't it also like connect with like major world events like 9-11? Didn't something happen with the random number generators like? 

18:23 - Liz Entin (Guest)
that that's the Global Consciousness. 

18:26 - Stacey (Host)
Project. Yes, what happened with that, roger Nelson? 

18:28 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Oh, it's so insane so I don't even know what to think of this. So they set up random number generators around the world and generating ones and zeros, ones and zeros. They follow the data. When crazy world events happen, the numbers start coming in non-randomly like a significant amount of either ones or zeros I don't remember which, or it might be different, but the whole data. If you look at the data point chart, it just changes and it goes from line, line, line. 

18:58
And now what's crazy is so this happened at 9-11, and you could think maybe this ties into emotion. The results in non-randomness starts before 9-11. 

19:09 - Stacey (Host)
No. So if you start seeing it happening, that means there might be a catastrophic event. That's going to happen. 

19:14 - Mark (Host)
Global event yeah, that is fascinating. Who's monitoring these things? Well, it's all around the world. 

19:18 - Liz Entin (Guest)
So it's all different people, will they tell us? Probably not what would they tell you? They're going to tell us Roger Nelson at Openly. There are people who monitors it. 

19:27 - Stacey (Host)
Guys, there's been a lot of ones and zeros, like I think there's been like non-randomness happening. There could be a major event that's going to, because people are talking about I've heard recently the end of the world again, you know, with all the world things that are happening in the world right now and the war and stuff like that that World War III could be about to happen. I would really appreciate it if Roger could call me and tell me if the numbers stop being random 

19:53
at any time soon, and maybe we can talk to Robin about that too. 

19:57 - Mark (Host)
So wait, let me give you my example of what you're talking about, because I believe that that consciousness could impact the physical reality. I don't know how or why I believe it, but I do and I think this is in Joe Dispenza's book, but I'm not sure. There was a study where they had a robot in sort of a little field area and it would just move. Randomly it would move. Are you familiar with this? 

20:14
It would move randomly and then correct me if I get it wrong, because it's been a while since I heard this. Then they took a bunch of chicks newborn chicks and they imprinted the chicks on the robot. So the chicks imprint, that's their mother. 

20:31
Now the first thing they see in theory is who their mother is right. So they imprinted on the robot and then they put the robot back into space. But they put the chicks on the side, who all they want is their mom, and they're chirping and whining and screaming for their mom. And apparently it influenced the randomness of the robot who would spend the entire time going all over, and now the robot who would spend the entire time going all over, and now the robot was spending all of its time down here. 

20:53
Over by the chicks Over by the chicks. Now I don't know the academic rigor of that research. I don't know anything. I just I think it's fascinating. 

21:01 - Stacey (Host)
Who was the book that you talked about? I? 

21:02 - Mark (Host)
think it was Joe Dispenza's book. 

21:03 - Stacey (Host)
What's the name of the book? 

21:04 - Mark (Host)
I can't remember for the life of me. Okay, it's the same concept, right, that consciousness affects. So consciousness exists apart from physical reality, which of course it does. I say to my wife all the time I'm like something is inside of us that goes away when we die. There is a thing in us consciousness, so it's got to go somewhere. To your point, it's going to the collective right. 

21:32 - Liz Entin (Guest)
I don't know if it's a collective if it's just a bunch of individuals. 

21:34 - Stacey (Host)
If it's a, I mean if I knew where it went, I would be a world famous scientist, get the Nobel Peace Prize or something. Yes, yes. What's the takeaway from what you've learned? Like if you can give them maybe three or four takeaways from your research for people who are interested in this topic. 

21:50 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Well, I think one thing is first opening your mind to it. And here's a way. If you're logical, that really was a game changer for me. It's the hard problem of consciousness. That really was a game changer for me. It's the hard problem of consciousness. And that is I've always kind of thought consciousness, without a doubt, was created by a brain. I thought there was some form of understanding of it that if I delved into neuroscience people would know but they have no idea, none how it would work. And it is just as weird, like this whole idea of my saying there's an afterlife and consciousness survives outside of a brain. That is so weird, it makes no sense. And it also makes no sense that a set of mass and matter, brain neurons come together and create our consciousness. And our consciousness is so complex, like if we were just here to like, survive, reproduce. You know, that was it, okay, created by a brain. But there's, it's both. Consciousness makes absolutely no sense. Whichever theory, fundamentally, yeah, it doesn't matter what you do. So you're saying to the audience. 

22:53 - Stacey (Host)
be open-minded, Like understand that, like what we're seeing every day. Be open-minded, Mark, Like what we're seeing every day that's in front of us. There could be so much more that we just don't know about and not to be scared of it, like I feel like maybe your research has helped you to not be scared of it or nervous about it. 

23:11 - Liz Entin (Guest)
I wasn't scared of it, I'm much more scared of the idea of permanent obliteration, like I saw no reason to be scared of, like other forms of consciousness, but it helped you with your grief Helped me with my grief. Yeah, very much. 

23:21 - Stacey (Host)
You were involved in the Harvey Weinstein trial? Yes, and you told us a little while ago that he is most absolutely guilty. 

23:29 - Liz Entin (Guest)
I don't doubt it. I mean, I wouldn't have gone on a stand in court and said he was guilty and put someone in jail if I wasn't 100% sure. 

23:37 - Stacey (Host)
And what's your relation to him in general? 

23:41 - Liz Entin (Guest)
I wasn't actually in the apartment, but my dog, peanut, who is on the other side, my adorable little chihuahua mix that you'll ever meet like he like broke into our apartment once, like I again, something I can't go into all the details of, but little peanut I I was actually not there that day this happened, but she chased him around and he was terrified. 

24:03 - Stacey (Host)
And that came up in my first testimony. 

24:06 - Liz Entin (Guest)
And it went viral, like all over the world. So Peanut is my little Chihuahua is world famous for chasing Harvey Weinstein, who was terrified of my 12 pound Chihuahua. That's amazing. 

24:16 - Mark (Host)
So wait. So I know you can't elaborate on it, but I want to make sure. I heard what you said Harvey Weinstein broke into your roommate's amazing so wait. 

24:22 - Liz Entin (Guest)
So I know you can't elaborate on it, but I want to make sure I heard what you said Harvey Weinstein broke into your roommate's apartment, mine and my roommate's. Yeah, yeah, again, like way too tied into the testimony. 

24:28 - Mark (Host)
Yeah, but you know in your heart of hearts and your logical brain of brains that he is guilty of what he was charged with. 

24:35 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Very much. Yes, I will say I actually feel really strongly about this. Right now we have people who aren't even getting an iota of due process and based on their skin color based, don't have you know and then the average person gets decent due process. 

25:10
Maybe they get lucky and get a fantastic lawyer and then you know, the richest of rich get an absolutely, absolutely fantastic amount of legal support. And I actually think the way it has worked with him is how it should work, even though I completely disagree with the overturning of the trial of the first verdict, completely disagree with it. But I think my problem is not how it's gone for him. Again, I 100% disagree with the overturning of the first verdict, but as much as I, you know, I don't know all the legal interactions, so, so maybe there was stuff I didn't understand that a judge would. 

25:44 - Stacey (Host)
We're not lawyers, we're not judges. But we actually just had Porfito on, who totally agrees with you. 

25:49 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Yeah. 

25:50 - Stacey (Host)
Yeah, he was a defense attorney. 

25:51 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Oh, I thought you said that. 

25:52 - Mark (Host)
Yeah, that's a good one. He was a prosecutor who changed because he didn't like the system. 

25:56 - Liz Entin (Guest)
He was always rigged against defendants. 

25:58 - Mark (Host)
The defense yeah. 

26:01 - Liz Entin (Guest)
I like the system. Yeah, it was rigged against it's the defense. Yeah, it felt rigged against a little, I don't know. I mean, I guess what I feel is I think everybody, regardless of their socioeconomic status, should have lawyers, especially if they're gonna be in jail the rest of their lives. He didn't get a life sentence, but at his age, his sentence left him in jail the rest of his life. From the person who doesn't have a dollar to their name to the you know, someone like Bill Gates everybody should have really good legal representation, no matter their side, and I think that's my problem. 

26:31 - Stacey (Host)
My main problem is the complete inequity were you at all nervous getting up on the stand, knowing the power that Harvey has? 

26:39 - Liz Entin (Guest)
oh, I didn't care about the power he has, like what's he gonna do to me, you know, but I, I didn't care about the power he has, like what's he going to do to me, you know? But I was, you know, had the adrenaline anxiety of like a powerful lawyer grilling me, but as soon as it started, I actually I loved it. 

26:52 - Stacey (Host)
Well, you're so articulate, I'm sure like you could just nail it. I would be like ah. 

26:57 - Mark (Host)
I saw reports where they were talking about how you would snap back you weren't intimidated. 

27:02 - Stacey (Host)
Oh, I love that You're feisty, right, feisty, good one, yeah, yeah. Well, I'm sure it upset you because your friend was involved and I'm sure she was going through it. 

27:11 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Yes, I mean, I really care about her. I care about. You know I hate injustice and there was a specific instance that I knew the facts of that. You know I can't run out and like change, sexual assault and mistreatment of people and animals overall. What can I really do? But you knew you could. But in this one tiny situation of someone who has an inordinate amount of power, I knew the facts of exactly what had happened and I could nail. 

27:40 - Stacey (Host)
Do something, yeah, do something like fight for that this one tiny instance. So and you did it, thank you. You did it, so congratulations for that. Thank you, I would have been scared. I was. I would have been so scared intimidating, so scared just the whole setting. 

27:57 - Liz Entin (Guest)
I was terrified the night before. 

27:58 - Stacey (Host)
Okay, okay, yeah, okay good, I'm glad to hear that, because I'm like I can't believe she just walked in there ballsy, like hey, yeah, you know. 

28:04 - Liz Entin (Guest)
No, I'm here, give me that whole adrenaline like before I walked in then, like once I walked in and sat, it was like I don't know. It just felt like it for me and I don't think everyone feels this way I felt very empowered I have two questions. 

28:17 - Mark (Host)
They're real short, short. Your dog that passed. 

28:20 - Stacey (Host)
Aw, do the same rules apply to that consciousness? 

28:23 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Oh, yeah, a dog's consciousness. An animal any animal, Definitely Okay. So they're all up there. Well, I'll say why because I don't think it's a very woo thing. If this is how brains work, why would one brain work differently than another? They're just slightly. 

28:35 - Stacey (Host)
Consciousness is consciousness, yeah, consciousness yeah, oh, we can see our animals, yeah make me so happy. 

28:43 - Mark (Host)
Yeah, we had a fish once when I was a kid. He was called the amazing, but he's not dead. 

28:46 - Stacey (Host)
Don't rush it jesus, I hope my son doesn't watch this what are you talking about? I'm not wishing death on your animals. 

28:53 - Mark (Host)
We had a fish called the floating petal of death. 

28:56 - Stacey (Host)
My son named him and the amazing bacon fish yeah my son was just a little kid. 

28:59 - Mark (Host)
He's like that. That one's the amazing bacon fish. Yeah, my son was just a little kid. He's like that one's the amazing bacon fish. And of course, they both died. 

29:04 - Liz Entin (Guest)
But we'll get to see them again, yeah, someday. Everyone dies, yes. Every fish, everyone dies, yes. 

29:11 - Mark (Host)
Oh, shoot, I forgot my next question. It was just oh, and maybe this is a yes no in the beginning, but do you see yourself ever getting to a point? 

29:24 - Liz Entin (Guest)
with your logical brain believing in god, I mean I'm not gonna say no because I mean I never would have thought there was an afterlife. But if they're, as of now, with all the information that's out there, no, but science is constantly evolving and if suddenly you know someone like the university of virginia or dr dean radin or one of these researchers comes out and says there is specific evidence that points in the direction of a God, which, how are you defining? A God Like a single individual consciousness that created all of this? 

29:53 - Mark (Host)
Then you already believe in that. 

29:55 - Stacey (Host)
No, I don't. Oh well, there's not, not a person. 

29:57 - Mark (Host)
Oh, single, I'm sorry, single individual. 

30:00 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Well, I don't know if our consciousness created this or did it create. Was it created by something we don't understand? Was it created just by pure Darwinian evolution? And consciousness evolved as much as like our body cells did? I have no idea. I mean, it seems the most logical. 

30:13 - Mark (Host)
It's just that you didn't believe in the afterlife. You did your research and now you do. Yeah, your research and now you do. Yeah, if science came up and said you know there is definitely a god, did you know you could then download consciousness or have thoughts of like somebody like hitler or pol pot or stalin, like that's a terrible thought, right, if a kid can, if a kid can have memories of I was in world war ii, and it's testable and provable yeah then anyone born today could be like oh yeah, I remember all the terrible things I did during World War II. 

30:42 - Stacey (Host)
It probably already happens. 

30:44 - Mark (Host)
God, I hope not. Could you imagine? Yes, it probably already happens. 

30:47 - Stacey (Host)
There's many people out there that are, you know, not great people. 

30:53 - Liz Entin (Guest)
Yeah, I'm sure. What if they're? 

30:54 - Stacey (Host)
just reincarnate. 

30:56 - Mark (Host)
Who knows Well that would be good, because then evil is contained. If you're an who knows, well, that would be good, because then evil is is contained only for an evil person. You can only go into an evil person. 

31:03 - Stacey (Host)
Okay, this is like next we're gonna start talking about the sim this. 

31:05 - Mark (Host)
Let's talk about that. Why are we? 

31:07 - Stacey (Host)
living in a room. No, we can't, it's 11 o'clock, but I would love oh, what a shame. 

31:11 - Mark (Host)
Oh man, that's a whole separate conversation yeah, thank you enough? How can people reach you? How I get to? How to get the word out? 

31:17 - Liz Entin (Guest)
oh yeah, please, um, come check out my website. Wtf, just happenednet. You can find my two books. You can find my podcast. You can find my. I'm most active on Instagram. I also host science and spirituality salons, which are intimate events where I give a talk on the science and research and a psychic medium who's verified and tested by scientists and researchers gives readings so you can reach out and learn more about that thank you guys for watching. 

31:45 - Stacey (Host)
Thank you you're still here. You're still listening. Thanks for listening to the gurus and game changers podcast while you're here. If you enjoyed it, please take a minute to rate this episode and leave us a quick review. We want to know what you thought of the show and what you took from it and how it might have helped you. We read and appreciate every comment. Thanks, see you next week.