Learning About the Stars from a Former Circus Clown | Ep 027

Unleash the power of play and the wonders of the night sky with Marlin, our illustrious former circus clown and fool-osopher. His laughter-laden stories from clown school to treehouse living offer a refreshing take on life's enchanting chaos. Step right up for an episode that promises to tickle your funny bone and ignite your imagination as Marlin weaves together humor and wisdom from his colorful life experiences.

Prepare to have your perspective on darkness illuminated as Marlin, decked out in his astro-tourism expertise, unveils the celestial magic obscured by our city lights. From chasing the northern lights to eagerly awaiting a total solar eclipse, we explore why preserving our dark skies is not just about stargazing, but also about fostering creativity and reconnecting with the natural world. So, look up and get lost in a discussion that blends awe-inspiring cosmic events with the importance of protecting our view of the universe.

Finally, Marlin serves up invaluable life lessons for all you young mavericks out there. Reflecting on the legacy of trailblazers like Buckminster Fuller and his own journey crafting the mesmerizing Luma show, Marlin encourages us to carve our unique paths. Whether you're a seasoned life adventurer or at the starting line of adulthood, this episode is brimming with counsel on living authentically and cherishing the originality that stars in each of us.

➡️ Talking Points
(00:03) - Wild Ride With Circus Clown
(11:51) - Play and Astro Tourism Importance
(16:22) - Astro Tourism and Treehouse Politics
(30:10) - Life Lessons for Young Mavericks

➡️ More info about Marlin
Website: https://www.mindofmarlin.com/
Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/michael-f-marlin-2a6b6214/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/michaelmarlin
Books: Astrotourism - https://a.co/d/3AnMRE1

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➡️ Thanks for watching - Ep 027 Clowning & Cosmic Wisdom
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Transcript

00:03 - Stacey (Host)
Well, Mark, that was a delightful conversation that we just had. I enjoyed that thoroughly. I know our audience is going to love this one. 

00:11 - Mark (Host)
It was a ride. It was a wild ride through incredible stories, funny stories about clown school and clown politics and the circus, because he ran away to the circus and inventing toys and he's lived 90 lives to my one. 

00:26 - Stacey (Host)
And he's a philosopher. He's a philosopher. He calls himself a fool-osopher and he really believes in just having fun, just like play. Everyone should play and it's just, I don't know, so refreshing. I was laughing so hard my stomach hurt. I almost peed my pants. It's a very entertaining podcast. I'm telling you you guys are going to love this. 

00:48 - Mark (Host)
He's got a really cool perspective because he's traveled the world. He's an author, he's a TED speaker, he has done so much and has a really cool perspective. But again, like you said, it all boils down to just have fun, embrace the happiness. 

01:04 - Stacey (Host)
He almost got killed as an elephant tamer. 

01:06 - Mark (Host)
Oh yeah. 

01:07 - Stacey (Host)
Elephant, what do you call it? 

01:08 - Marlin (Guest)
Elephant rumor. 

01:09 - Mark (Host)
Elephant rumor In the circus Elephant keeper. 

01:13 - Stacey (Host)
You guys, you guys have to watch Marlin, yeah this is going to be a good one. 

01:17 - Mark (Host)
Enjoy, buckle up and enjoy the show. I'm Marlin. 

01:22 - Stacey (Host)
Hi, I'm Stacy. 

01:23 - Mark (Host)
And I am Mark, and this is the Guru's Game Changers Podcast. Welcome everybody. Well, compared to today's guest and Marlin, I have to admit I live a pretty boring life. Marlin ran away with the circus at the age of 18 to become an elephant keeper. He was making a living as a juggler at 19. He was on national television by 20 and ultimately he rose to become a very prominent and acclaimed Las Vegas performer and comedy club headliner. And then, while all of us would say wow, what a great start, embrace that cherished build on it. He gave it all up. For what Wait for it To go live in a tree house in a jungle with no electricity? 

02:07 - Stacey (Host)
Yes, he did Five years. 

02:10 - Mark (Host)
That's crazy Talk about, like the road, less traveled. This man exemplifies that Fast forward. He's a humorist, he's a world traveler, he's an inventor, he's a speaker. He has lived the 100,000 foot perspective of life and how to make the most of it and make everyday. County's going to share all of that with us, recognizing what matters most. Oh, and, by the way, he is a globally recognized expert on astrotourism, dark sky and light pollution. I know there's a lot to unpack here. I don't know where this conversation is going to take us, but I know it's going to be a good ride. Marlin, welcome to the show buddy. 

02:47 - Stacey (Host)
Thank you, marlin. We are so thrilled to have you here. We're so proud of you here. 

02:50 - Marlin (Guest)
This is fun. What a great intro. I want to meet this guy, oh please come on in, we're happy to meet you as soon as you're not in Vietnam anymore. 

02:57 - Stacey (Host)
Come on and stop by. 

02:59 - Mark (Host)
Let me take you back. I want to go back to the circus. Sure, I'm going to start at the beginning. You've lived this wild ride of a life, so we've all heard about people. You know they're going to run away with the circus. You actually did it and it's a very courageous thing to do. Right? Where did that courage come from at 18? 

03:17 - Marlin (Guest)
You know it was part courage and it was part fear. This was 1974. I was doing street parties, street parties and children's parties and juggling. And I got a job at a cheese store to pay the rent right, and because the juggling was still a side hustle and the owner saw me juggling, he goes hey, I want to go stand out in front and get tried to people in some out there juggling salamis and cheeseballs. And these clowns walk up and they're like real clowns and I say what are you two clowns doing in the mall? And I realized when it came out of my mouth like wait a minute. That's usually the same for people who were like you know? 

03:56 - Stacey (Host)
sure no, they should Real clowns. 

03:59 - Marlin (Guest)
So they're seeing me and they go hey, you're pretty good at that. Have you ever done any calling? I said do children's parties count? They go, yeah, they go. Would you like a job in the circus, Just like that. Oh, it's going to say no to that. 

04:11 - Mark (Host)
Right. 

04:12 - Marlin (Guest)
And the irony is is that I had to avoid the draft because there was still the draft going on and sending people to Vietnam. I had taken the test and I was going to be an air traffic controller. The recruitment center was right next to the cheese store. All I had to do was go in and raise my hand and say I do, and that was going to happen the next day, wow, wow. And people offered me a job as a clown in the circus and I went yeah, baby, I mean, that's like that's the golden ticket. So what happened? How I ended up with the elephants is I get hired as a clown and I get fired after the third day. Now, if you get fired as a clown, there's an existential crisis. 

04:58 - Stacey (Host)
Wait, there's a story there about how did you get fired. 

05:01 - Mark (Host)
How did you get fired? 

05:02 - Marlin (Guest)
I know how'd you get fired as a clown, okay. So in the circus there's a thing called the production gag, and when the trapeze is being set up or the wild cat animal cage is being taken down, they need to pull focus. So they sent out a bunch of clowns to do a sketch. Right, it's called a production, a production gag. So I'm in the production gag and all I had to do was blow a whistle. That was it, and I went. You mean, I gave up my flat and came all the way here and all I'm doing is blowing a whistle. Who aspires to blow a whistle? I mean, maybe a lifeguard or referee, right? So I said, can I please do something else? He said, okay, you can do some carpet clowning, and carpet clown is up in the stands when the tent is being filled up before the show starts. You're doing close up clowning, right, you're clowning for this person, this row, and I nailed it. I nailed it. 

05:59
Now there was one other old clown on the show, berkey, the comic cop. Berkey was 79 years old and was an original Max Senate Keystone cop. This guy was still alive, right, and I was upstaging him and he was on the other side of the tent. So then my boss comes to me on the second day and goes you can't do the carpet clowning anymore, it's just for Abe, abe Goldfarb, you can't do it anymore. I was crestfallen so I went outside the tent. I'm not even in the tent, I'm outside the tent making balloon animals doing some close up clowning, and I hear this guy go hey you kid what? 

06:42
I can't hear it over the squeaking, you know, over the squeaking balloon Kid. You and I turn around and he's snarling mask of fury. 

06:51 - Stacey (Host)
Get out of here what do you think you're doing? 

06:53 - Marlin (Guest)
And I ran away and that upset him and he told the owner and the older told her of my boss and my boss said I'm sorry, kid, I gotta let you go. 

07:03 - Mark (Host)
Wow. 

07:04 - Stacey (Host)
Because you were good at what you did. Circus politics, circus clown politics. 

07:08 - Marlin (Guest)
Hey, I know it's circus politics. So it's not just circus, it's showbiz politics. I learned that many times going through my career that if you shine too bright, people don't want to share the stage with you. It's crazy, that's disappointing. They'll slap you down. So, anyways, I'm on the lot the next day to collect $10 that I loaned to the elephant guy there, the guy who's not the trainer. There's a groom, he's called a bull man Because in the circus elephants are called bulls. And I came back to collect the $10. And while I'm there, this old, grizzled, gnarly gnome of a man comes up to me and goes hey, kid, I think I know you and I go. 

07:51
I have never seen you before in my life. No, I think I know you. No, I don't think. So he goes. You need a job? Yes, a matter of fact, I do, jessica fired his clown. Elephants no. 

08:06 - Mark (Host)
Have you been around any livestock? 

08:09 - Marlin (Guest)
Well, yeah, cows and horses, oh, you'll be fine. And he gives me this phone number and I call the guy up and I go out. His name is Bucky Steele. He takes me out back, opens his barn he's got five elephants in there, wow and offers me the job as the groom Just like that. 

08:28 - Mark (Host)
How long were you with the circus? 

08:30 - Marlin (Guest)
I was in that job, in that particular position, for 14 months, and so for the first month when I'm mucking right, shoveling, and doing all this, he says I'll be with you every morning and evening. When you do this and I go, don't you think I can do it? I mean, I'm just shoveling manure, he goes. Oh, I don't have any problem thinking you'll do it. I just want to make sure the elephants don't kill you. Oh my gosh. 

08:56 - Stacey (Host)
Are they scary? Were they scary? 

08:58 - Marlin (Guest)
Well, this is the thing. Elephants have killed more people and all of the other acts combined times two. 

09:07 - Mark (Host)
Seriously. 

09:07 - Marlin (Guest)
In the circus Seriously, and most of them are drifters and people you never hear about. 

09:14 - Mark (Host)
No fancy. 

09:15 - Marlin (Guest)
I was 18. I'm doing the job of guys who are like in their 50s and 60s, a lot of them just dead-enders, nowhere to go. But this job and there were times when my life was very much on the line and I saved one guy's life from being killed and there was one time when I almost got killed myself. I mean it was that far from being killed by one of my own charges, from startling her, and sure enough, when I was doing research for my book, a bullman died in that very arena startling one of his elephants. They get scared, they trample you, they can kill you just with their trunk knocking you or kicking you. I mean they're so powerful and they can do it without even trying to. 

10:04 - Stacey (Host)
They seem so docile, but they'll take your word for it. 

10:08 - Marlin (Guest)
Yes, they are docile until they're not. Whatever you do, don't back down they probably smell your fear. 

10:17 - Stacey (Host)
Pretty tough yeah they'll smell your fear. 

10:18 - Marlin (Guest)
They're going to challenge you, but do not back down. And sure enough, the little male that he had. He challenged me and there was that moment of truth what am I going to do? He lowered his head, he backed up, he was ready to either hit me or butt me. So I punched him in the eye. 

10:37 - Mark (Host)
That's what you're supposed to do with the shark too. 

10:39 - Stacey (Host)
Like if your shark comes out, you're supposed to punch him in the eye. 

10:42 - Mark (Host)
Yeah, really, I didn't know that. Ok, yeah, that's a thing. Yeah, go for the eyes. Next time you're with sharks, always go for the eyes. 

10:47 - Stacey (Host)
Wow, well, so that's what you're doing in Vietnam, right? You're actually researching and talking about, or thinking about, your elephant history, because you're writing a demo on the time. 

10:58 - Marlin (Guest)
Well, no, I wrote a paper in Vietnam in October 22 to write my memoir of this time as an elephant keeper. There is not a book. I've looked. There isn't a book that's ever been written as a firsthand account. Nonfiction of an elephant keeper, a bullman in the circus. The title of the book is the Toll Paid on the Road Less Traveled. 

11:23 - Mark (Host)
That's the thing I said the road less traveled in the intro. That's hilarious. 

11:26 - Stacey (Host)
I love that, so so yeah so, speaking of Vietnam, I saw the video that you posted up about the birds in the cage. Then you, you set one free. Oh, yes, that video that you set one free. That to me I feel like it was sort of symbolic. Like you seem like such a free spirit, like I watched so many of your interviews and you know, in addition to being, like you know, brilliant philosopher on astrotourism, like you're also a free spirit. So my question to you is like what advice would you give to people you know, whether they're scholars or not, like enlightening up and just having fun with what they do? 

12:00 - Marlin (Guest)
Well, the single best piece of advice I give is never take a single piece of advice. Actually, what was it? Benjamin Franklin said advice is often given and seldom taken. Right, okay, but if I'm starting a An instant, an Institute or whatever, a conservatory, a conservatory of creativity, teaching people how to use their imagination, how to amplify and strengthen their creativity through inspired play, so this something that adults forget. 

12:41
Now, there's a difference between play and competing. Yeah, you'll go out and play golf, you'll play tennis, but the aim is to win right Play there is no winner because there's. You're not competing right. So, like blowing bubbles or playing with blocks or, you know, playing any kind of Something that, where there isn't an outcome that needs to be met for you to enjoy yourself, right, as they say, it's not whether you win or lose, it's how you play. 

13:17 - Mark (Host)
Play, play for play sake. 

13:19 - Marlin (Guest)
Einstein said that play is the highest form of research. Yeah, who's gonna? 

13:24 - Stacey (Host)
argue with him. 

13:27 - Marlin (Guest)
Yeah. 

13:28 - Stacey (Host)
I watched one of your TED Talks. So so good. You spent like the first five minutes of the TED Talk in darkness and then you juggled iridescent balls and helped the audience Understand the dangers of light pollution. So where are we now globally, in your mind, in our efforts to preserve the dark sky? And for anyone who doesn't, doesn't know what dark sky is, maybe feel us in on that too. 

13:51 - Marlin (Guest)
Okay, so thank you for the question. 80% of North Americans cannot see the Milky Way. 60% of Europeans cannot see the Milky Way. 99% of the world's population is impacted by some form of light pollution. Now, edison brought forth the, the release of this illuminated bulb back at the end of the 19th century, and the first year there was 400. In the second year there were 10,000, and that number has never decreased since then. So what has happened is we have basically set our nights on fire with electricity and it is literally impossible for people to be able to go out and see the night sky unless they travel a Long ways to get out from under this dome of light that we're all living under. People like to go to dark sky places, and the biggest question that people have goes well, if you turn off the lights, isn't that going to increase crime? Right, number one, there's no studies that show that that's the case, but I always say well, if life prevented crime, then there wouldn't be any crime during the day I love. 

15:16 - Stacey (Host)
It makes sense you've done so many things and you are playful and you are fun, but then astro tourism just seems very like a very serious Thing, right? I mean, maybe not maybe like looking at the stars, and you've written a book on astro tourism. What is it and what's the difference between astro tourism and space tourism? 

15:37 - Mark (Host)
Hey guys, thanks for listening. If you like what you're hearing, please leave us a review, give us a follow, subscribe, subscribe all those things, all the things. We love it because we read each and every comment and it helped shape the show, so we would appreciate it please, and back to the show. 

15:52 - Marlin (Guest)
I Got that one? Yes, I would think Space tourism as you go to a place to look down, yeah, look up yeah that's hilarious. 

16:07 - Mark (Host)
Very simple but accurate description, right. 

16:10 - Marlin (Guest)
Yeah, space tourism is reserved for a very Elite few who had the money. Astro tourism is available to anybody who can escape the dome of light that they're living under. And and the astro tourism, how I became an expert in this field all came from me playing in the dark with light. Hmm, right. 

16:32 - Mark (Host)
She loves to be in the dark. 

16:35 - Marlin (Guest)
Yeah, well, you know I tell people as children were afraid of the dark. But when we become an adult we realize some of the best times we ever have in our lives or when the lights are out. 

16:47 - Stacey (Host)
I've always wanted to see the northern lights, so that's something that I feel like could be asterotourism. So you're raising your hand, so where's the best place to see the northern lights? 

16:58 - Marlin (Guest)
In the north. 

17:00 - Mark (Host)
As north as you can get. 

17:01 - Marlin (Guest)
Marlin Okay, that's right. Okay, look, it's, you know, okay. Number one the northern lights are happening all the time, right, but you can only see them in the wintertime because you need to have darkness and you have to go. There's a thing called the auroral zone, which is like this band up towards the north pole, not exactly the north pole, but right around it, and I don't remember what the degrees and latitudes are, but you know Alaska, greenland, iceland, finland, the upper parts of Finland and Sweden, norway, and those are the best places to see it. However, they are not always consistent. 

17:41
You can get an app that lets you know when there's a solar flare that's happening. There's an app for that and it's got something like I don't know 17 minutes or whatever it is, or however long, it takes eight minutes before it actually hits. You know the magnosphere around our planet and creates that, so there's a little bit of a warning sign, but it's. You're gonna have to go during the winter and there are places I mentioned in my book where they've got these classic lus, where you can get nice and cozy and warm and that's what I wanna do. 

18:10 - Stacey (Host)
Nice so fun, but. 

18:12 - Marlin (Guest)
I must say that the grand stellar, the Taylor Swift of celestial events is a total solar eclipse. And there's another solar eclipse happening in America April 8th. Now get this. After war and famine, more people are temporarily displaced by a total eclipse. So the only thing that moves more people than a total eclipse for temporary migration is war and famine. 

18:49 - Mark (Host)
How so People traveling to see it? 

18:52 - Marlin (Guest)
Yes, people traveling to see it. Millions, millions of people will travel to get into the line of totality. Got it Right. The last one that happened in 2017, 18 times more people watch that than the final episode of Game of Thrones. Wow, just simply Google Great American Eclipse 2024 and you'll see the path and where you need to go. Most of the people who live in these cities where the totality is going to happen right Live under the dome of light, have never seen the Milky Way, have never seen the sky full of stars. 

19:33
This is an opportunity for that to happen if and only if the municipalities flip the switch to keep lights from coming on when everything goes dark. Right, wow, all of the street lights will come on and it'll look just like it does any other night, any other night, except you'll see the moon and the corona. 

19:55 - Mark (Host)
We have to talk about you living in a jungle tree house with no electricity for five years of your life. First off, how did you get to that point? And then, secondly, what was it like? What did it teach you about yourself? 

20:07 - Marlin (Guest)
Okay. So the brass ring was taken out of my hands three different times. In 1978, in 77, I did my first national television Don Kirchner's Rock concert For those of you who are old enough remember it and everybody was like, oh my God, this you know, I hit I. You know. Don Kirchner said I was going to do for juggling what Doug Henning did for magic. And then in 78, I toured with Doug Henning and then I was slated to do the Tonight Show with Johnny Carson. He was a star maker, he was. I got bumped. I got bumped. Someone the night before went overtime and took that guy's spot and the guy took my place. And the guy who took my place you're not gonna believe this was a cow chip thrower from Beaver, oklahoma. Oh my God. 

21:01 - Stacey (Host)
Cow poop Yup. 

21:05 - Mark (Host)
He didn't get his star made, I'm sure. 

21:07 - Marlin (Guest)
No, and so and I tried to get on for the next 10 years, tried to get on, but a new director came in and he never gave me my shot. So that was one. The second one I did a series of 10 Toyota commercials that I produced and starred in and it won Addy Awards Best Regional Campaign, best of Show, and it almost went national Almost and there was a fallout between the regional campaign ad agency and the national campaign ad agency. So never the twain shall meet. And then the third time I was to be the host of a late night comedy show called Off the Wall, and we're rehearsing this thing for like a month and the day of the taping this guy comes in with an agent that nobody had seen on the set. Who does the opening spot, takes my place and his name was Kevin Pollock. Oh wow. Went on to star with Robert De Niro, sure and Tom Cruise. 

22:11
Tom Cruise is done me more Paul Matlow and Jack Lemon, and at that point I was sitting in my house looking up at the ceiling. I guess that whoever's up in the ceiling going I get it. I'm not supposed to be doing this, oh well. So I got an invite to come and join a bunch of jugglers who was buying some land in Hawaii and I went out there and it was all about self-sustainability. I'd been growing food and I wanted to learn more about it and I threw in, I sold everything, moved out there and had this experience and, to sum it up, it was Gilligan's Island meets Lord of the Flies. 

22:52 - Mark (Host)
That sounds scary. That's the Lord of the Flies part. It was. What did your day look like? Living in a tree house? 

23:01 - Marlin (Guest)
First thing, you wake up and you swap mosquitoes, okay, and then later on you chase away the flies that are feeding off the dead mosquitoes that are on your body. 

23:14 - Mark (Host)
Realize like a dream. 

23:16 - Stacey (Host)
That was the Lord of the Flies part right, or was it Well? 

23:19 - Marlin (Guest)
yeah, clearing jungle, pulling up the invasive species of the guavas to rescue the ohias, which are the endemic trees building my place growing food. We would go out in the nights and walk for a couple of hours to see the lava flowing, and so the day was like it was a lot of hard work. I mean, breaking jungle is Tough right. 

23:48 - Stacey (Host)
That's what they call it breaking jungle. 

23:51 - Marlin (Guest)
Well, I mean, you're basically having to, you know, cut it back so that you have a space to live. 

23:56 - Stacey (Host)
What happened after the tree house, like what? So you were there for how long? And then what? Where'd? 

24:00 - Marlin (Guest)
you go For six years and then they threw me out. No, what are you? 

24:03 - Stacey (Host)
talking about? Yeah, I got, I was a found Tree house politics, oh no, cloud politics, tree house politics. 

24:11 - Marlin (Guest)
I was a maverick amongst misfits. 

24:15 - Stacey (Host)
Basically Right. 

24:17 - Marlin (Guest)
Well, what happened was was it became very clickish and I was advocating for a communication template or a model that would level the playing field. Well, it wasn't until later in life that I learned that the power base, they don't want to level playing field and they will marginalize and push anybody off the board who's advocating for a level playing field. And so I got pushed out. They tore down my house and it was rad. It was a two-story 900 square foot treehouse that made it into the Lonely Planet Guide to Hawaii. 

24:55 - Mark (Host)
But I have a memory of it. 

24:56 - Marlin (Guest)
I mean, you know I've got that. And then I went and bought some other land and started all over. 

25:02 - Mark (Host)
Oh, my goodness. 

25:04 - Marlin (Guest)
In Hawaii, on the Big Island, yeah, yeah, about a mile away from where that was. 

25:09 - Mark (Host)
That's wild. So you, you, you have, I've heard you say, and so at some point in one of your speeches or somewhere, that you prefer to be off your rocker than in it. Right, right, and you call yourself a philosopher instead of a philosopher. What tell us about that mindset? 

25:29 - Marlin (Guest)
Philosophy is making people laugh and think at the same time, Because if you just give them something to think about, there's usually this wall that's up. But if you can make them laugh, if you can tickle them into enlightenment, then they lit down their guard and they're a little more trusting, Right? So that's why I say look, take everything with the granite gestalt and that's. You know, people have got to want to. You know when, when this, when the, when the student is ready, the teacher will appear. Yeah, Right, you know. And so my particular brand of approaching life isn't for everybody, you know, but I honestly believe that you know, enlightenment comes from being lighthearted, you know, and, and, and, the, the Dalai. 

26:24
Lama he's always laughing. Right, he's always laughing. So that's what they call them the. 

26:31
Jali Lama. So it's one of the reasons why I say you know, one of the fastest way through your karma is humor. When you can find what's funny about what's happened, then it no longer has control over you. And this is this is the work, this is the you know being able to reframe the circumstance. For instance, we all know Sisyphus curse to push the rock up the hill, right Curse to push the rock. Well, how can we reframe that so that it wasn't a curse? Well, simple, he liked watching the rock roll down the hill so much he couldn't wait to push it back. 

27:09 - Mark (Host)
That's definitely a reframing. 

27:12 - Stacey (Host)
I love it. So we? How did you come to be like? What's your family like? Are your parents philosophers too? Were they serious Like do you have brothers and sisters? Like how, how are you formed? 

27:25 - Marlin (Guest)
Well, I was formed, pretty much like all other human beings are formed. No, honestly, I came from a highly dysfunctional and toxic environment. 

27:34 - Mark (Host)
Wow, were you the youngest? Yeah, usually the youngest is the funniest. 

27:38 - Marlin (Guest)
Yeah, much younger than all of my other siblings, I was the. That was the fourth child that my father did not want, and there was part of the reason that I wrote the book. The Contemplative Naval was to find a way through to make sense of all of what happened. So in a lot of spiritual literature they say you have to learn to love your family before you can go out and love the world. Right. 

28:08
That's where it's well. That was a tough one for me because it was. It was abusive, both physically and emotionally, and my father left my mother after 25 years of marriage. My other siblings were already out of the house. I was left alone with this very embittered woman who did not want a precocious teenage son. She was trying to find a husband. So, you know, she found another husband. I bonded with him. She divorced him, married another guy. He threw me out of the house when I was 17 and still in high school, because he was. He wanted mommy 2.0. And so learning it caused me to read a lot of works, john Bradshaw, on the family, for instance. Coming from a multiple broken home, the curse was, well, I didn't have really much of a pleasant childhood. The blessing is I also wasn't programmed and didn't have to take on all of the messages and all of the value sets that parents usually give their kids, and then they, you know, spend a lifetime trying to shake it off. 

29:23 - Mark (Host)
Yeah, who was a positive influence on you? Who was your? Who, if you had a name of guru, that sort of, put their arm, their arm around your shoulder and kind of led you down the right path. 

29:33 - Marlin (Guest)
Well, when I was 19, there was a gentleman by the name of Bill Palmer. He was a magician, so a few years, maybe 10 years older than me, he's still alive and he gave me a job at New vaudeville pizza parlor like a steady job, I wasn't just hustling on the streets and that gave me the opportunity to really hone my craft and develop a lot of material, because I had to do three 15 minute sets. Junkers usually do a six to eight minute set and that's it. That's all they do. So now I'm having to develop all of this new content. So that was a huge, a huge benefit. Back when I was 19 years old, you know reading, reading the books of people like Buck's, minister Fuller. You know he was definitely like changing, because he lived his life as an experiment and was, I think, living in a chicken coop or something like that. 

30:32
He was a thinker. He redesigned it but he basically took a chicken coop and, you know, outfitted it so it'd be livable. That's what I remember in his book Critical Path. It's funny when you are, when you're a maverick, when you're out cutting your own path and being the pioneer, there's not a lot of people who can mentor you because you're, you know, the pioneers. There were the ones who took, there are the ones who took the arrows, who died of starvation, who got lost in the wilderness. It's the ones who followed, who were the settlers. 

31:14 - Mark (Host)
Right. 

31:15 - Marlin (Guest)
Because they settle. Pioneers have to keep going. So you know, I took my inspiration from all kinds of, from different artists, from music, when I went to go to create Luma, which stood for 21 years, which led me into the dark sky, thank you. I made it a point not to go see anybody else's shows. I didn't go see Blue man. I didn't go see Cirque du Soleil. I went. I do not want their ideas in my head, so I would go to a planetarium or an aquarium or a gallery or a museum or anything other than that and let that inspire me, let that be my teacher. 

31:56 - Mark (Host)
Yeah, good, let me ask you something what experience based on your experience, what finish the sentence the best piece of advice that Marlon can give, that I can give to somebody just starting out in their life and starting out in adulthood. What is the best piece of advice you could give to somebody? 

32:17 - Marlin (Guest)
Yeah, well, I mean, I think they answered that before. Never take a single piece of advice. I would say. I would say this when you die, people do not remember you for how much money was in your bank account, but by how many people you served and how many lives you changed for the better. Don't wait to do your dream. Don't wait, take the chance, take the risk. And a lot of people say, well, that's easy for you to say, because you don't have a mortgage, okay, get out from under the mortgage If the mortgage is keeping you from living your dream. Do your dream, don't? You wanna live a life that at the end of it, you can look back and say, yeah, I went for it, as opposed to saying I wish I had? 

33:10 - Mark (Host)
I wish I had yeah. 

33:11 - Marlin (Guest)
Don't live a life that say I wish I had. That's good advice. 

33:16 - Stacey (Host)
I love that Sweet. So how can we help you get whatever word you're trying to get out there, out there, and what's next for you? 

33:25 - Marlin (Guest)
Well, okay, so thank you very much for asking. I appreciate that. I am about to launch the Conservatory of Creativity and it's a four module course with three lessons in each module, and it brings people into my world, the mind of Marlin, and teaches them different ways through Inspire Play to expand their creativity, to sharpen their imagination, to improve their interpersonal communications, to be a better father to your kid or a better mother to your kid, because you'll be able to join them in your play. Right, To be better with your coworkers, because when you have a better imagination and better creativity, you're better problem solving. We all want that. You're more productive, you're more joyous, you're healthier. Right, Because laughing is one of these things that releases all of these great dopamine and endomorphins and all of these wonderful things in you. People are laughing, are happy people, Tying in and learning how to play again, just learning how to play again. 

34:38
A lot of people have forgotten how to do that and it's kind of sad. I say that play is the fountain of youth and a lot of adults are dying of thirst. 

34:48 - Mark (Host)
Yeah. 

34:49 - Stacey (Host)
I love this. 

34:50 - Mark (Host)
Yeah, it's almost. It's looked at as a bad thing when you get to a certain age. I don't have time to play, but you know, grow up right. 

34:57 - Marlin (Guest)
Why? What does that even mean Exactly? 

35:02 - Mark (Host)
Exactly. 

35:03 - Stacey (Host)
I hope you never, ever grow up. 

35:05 - Marlin (Guest)
You can age, you can grow older, but you can stay young regardless of how old you are. Yes, and one of the things I remember when I went to my first juggling convention when I was 15 years old, and I saw people my age now right, the age I'm at now, and when people ask me how old I am, I say I'm timeless. 

35:30 - Mark (Host)
So people with gray hair, people with no? 

35:32 - Marlin (Guest)
hair and I saw them juggling and they're flipping clubs and doing all this and I'm going, I wanna have that when I'm that age and I do, and I can Nice Right, I still have my reflexes, I can still juggle five balls, I can still pass clubs and when people you know, I met some younger folks here who are in the circus, in a circus here in Vietnam, and they asked me how old I was. I said I'm timeless and then, after a few glasses of wine and beers, I finally revealed my age. I think I want to have what you have when I'm here, then I'm living it. I'm living the example for now, the youth to go. How can I hold on to my moxie, my magic, my enthusiasm when I get to be, you know, gray hair? 

36:28 - Stacey (Host)
Wow, you're an inspiration. 

36:30 - Mark (Host)
I'm inspired. Keep your mojo, for sure. 

36:33 - Stacey (Host)
Where can we reach? Oh, where'd it go? How can I my life's? So I snap my finger in my life. So so how can I get in touch with you? Is there a website or like what? 

36:44 - Marlin (Guest)
Yes, mindofmarlin, mindofmarlincom, the conservatory of creativity age, is about to be loaded any day now. It's a whole new thing I'm having to learn. It's amazing. Those of us who grew up in the analog world have to learn how to make our way in the digital world For sure. And we'll do something like this. It's like, oh my gosh, how many different software programs do I have to learn? Excel, microsoft Word, powerpoint, how to do Zoom, how to do art, all of these different things, more and more. How to learn Canva? It's endless. 

37:23 - Mark (Host)
So You're a maverick right, Mavericks can figure that stuff out. You're pretty darn smart. I think you've got it. 

37:29 - Stacey (Host)
Well, thank you, well, thank you. 

37:33 - Mark (Host)
Yeah, thank you for joining us. This has been a great conversation. Thank you so much. I'm inspired Especially putting your time aside. 

37:38 - Stacey (Host)
It's working. 

37:38 - Mark (Host)
it's working, Whatever you're doing, it's working, giving us mojo, giving us the moxie. I love it. 

37:44 - Marlin (Guest)
Thanks, thank you so much. Thank you so much for having me on and letting me share my gift. You gotta play with me. 

37:49 - Mark (Host)
well, have a great day. 

37:55 - Stacey (Host)
You're still here. You're still listening. Thanks for listening to the Gurus and Game Changers podcast While you're here. If you enjoyed it, please take a minute to rate this episode and leave us a quick review. We wanna know what you thought of the show and what you took from it and how it might have helped you. We read and appreciate every comment. Thanks, see you next week.